|
Post by cardinalblacktrojan on Oct 16, 2017 6:59:49 GMT -6
Just because the offense has been less than stellar this season doesn't mean Troy should scrap the spread offense... Troy had one of the top offenses in the Sun Belt for many years, even last year. You won't like the results if Troy plays a run-based offense. It didn't work in Fleetwood's last few years, and it wouldn't work in today's world of spread offenses. The fact of the matter is, small programs like Troy can't consistently recruit the big talented offensive linemen, the big talented RB's, and the big WR's that can block, catch, AND have speed, that would make an offense like that work. The only teams that can be effective with a run-based offense at our level is Boise State, who is able to recruit nothing but 3-star players and some 4-star players, and your triple-option offenses like Navy, New Mexico, and Georgia Southern. The spread offense is a good offense and I'm not saying we should abandon it... well let's play it differently it for a while. The spread is great until you match it against a defense with speed and the ability to put pressure on the qb. Our OL this year is better at run block than pass protection, hence Silvers gets a lot of pressure. Well ok, we have three world class running backs. If you watch the LSU game, and if you agree that it wasn't a fluke, then you will see we won that game offensively by running the ball. I don't think anyone would disagree that the LSU defense is one of the best we have or will face this year. If we can run the ball against LSU, then we should be able to run the ball against the rest of our schedule. After this season we lose most of our offense to graduation etc... so we will need the spread next season. This season we have the personnel to line up and smash people with the run game. We should be putting up 300 yards a game on the ground. I think we need to be a run first offense this season. You have the LSU game, and then you have the USA game where Troy had 15 carries for just 47 yards. That's just 3.1 yards per carry. We may have some great RB's, but the O-Line just isn't consistent enough to make the run game work like that. Troy had a great game plan and the players came out with fire. The opposite can be said about the USA game. As soon as the offense went 3-and-out on the first drive against USA, I knew we were in trouble. There was such a lack of energy from the sidelines.
|
|
|
Post by Trojan By Birth on Oct 16, 2017 7:15:37 GMT -6
The spread offense is a good offense and I'm not saying we should abandon it... well let's play it differently it for a while. The spread is great until you match it against a defense with speed and the ability to put pressure on the qb. Our OL this year is better at run block than pass protection, hence Silvers gets a lot of pressure. Well ok, we have three world class running backs. If you watch the LSU game, and if you agree that it wasn't a fluke, then you will see we won that game offensively by running the ball. I don't think anyone would disagree that the LSU defense is one of the best we have or will face this year. If we can run the ball against LSU, then we should be able to run the ball against the rest of our schedule. After this season we lose most of our offense to graduation etc... so we will need the spread next season. This season we have the personnel to line up and smash people with the run game. We should be putting up 300 yards a game on the ground. I think we need to be a run first offense this season. You have the LSU game, and then you have the USA game where Troy had 15 carries for just 47 yards. That's just 3.1 yards per carry. We may have some great RB's, but the O-Line just isn't consistent enough to make the run game work like that. Troy had a great game plan and the players came out with fire. The opposite can be said about the USA game. As soon as the offense went 3-and-out on the first drive against USA, I knew we were in trouble. There was such a lack of energy from the sidelines. 3.1 yards a carry is a win. 3*4=12. The sample size of 15 carries is way too small. We should have run way more than that.
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 7:44:04 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 7:44:04 GMT -6
You have the LSU game, and then you have the USA game where Troy had 15 carries for just 47 yards. That's just 3.1 yards per carry. We may have some great RB's, but the O-Line just isn't consistent enough to make the run game work like that. Troy had a great game plan and the players came out with fire. The opposite can be said about the USA game. As soon as the offense went 3-and-out on the first drive against USA, I knew we were in trouble. There was such a lack of energy from the sidelines. 3.1 yards a carry is a win. 3*4=12. The sample size of 15 carries is way too small. We should have run way more than that. It was also the type of runs we were calling Even the ESPN announcers were commenting on it Chun is a beast when he runs north-south and can lower his pads yet we were running sideline to sideline with him
|
|
|
Post by Bubba the Trojan on Oct 16, 2017 7:47:35 GMT -6
You have the LSU game, and then you have the USA game where Troy had 15 carries for just 47 yards. That's just 3.1 yards per carry. We may have some great RB's, but the O-Line just isn't consistent enough to make the run game work like that. Troy had a great game plan and the players came out with fire. The opposite can be said about the USA game. As soon as the offense went 3-and-out on the first drive against USA, I knew we were in trouble. There was such a lack of energy from the sidelines. 3.1 yards a carry is a win. 3*4=12. The sample size of 15 carries is way too small. We should have run way more than that. 3.1 yards per leaves us with a 4th and one every series. If the average isn't at least 3.4 per, the chains aren't moving and the run game is ineffective as a PRIMARY means of advancing the ball. Now if you have a 3.1 yard average and run a balanced attack with a 5-7 yard per pass avg, it's good, but you can't count on successfully going for fourth and one on a regular basis to make the offense effective.
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 7:51:30 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 7:51:30 GMT -6
Just because the offense has been less than stellar this season doesn't mean Troy should scrap the spread offense... Troy had one of the top offenses in the Sun Belt for many years, even last year. You won't like the results if Troy plays a run-based offense. It didn't work in Fleetwood's last few years, and it wouldn't work in today's world of spread offenses. The fact of the matter is, small programs like Troy can't consistently recruit the big talented offensive linemen, the big talented RB's, and the big WR's that can block, catch, AND have speed, that would make an offense like that work. The only teams that can be effective with a run-based offense at our level is Boise State, who is able to recruit nothing but 3-star players and some 4-star players, and your triple-option offenses like Navy, New Mexico, and Georgia Southern. The spread offense is a good offense and I'm not saying we should abandon it... well let's play it differently it for a while. The spread is great until you match it against a defense with speed and the ability to put pressure on the qb. Our OL this year is better at run block than pass protection, hence Silvers gets a lot of pressure. Well ok, we have three world class running backs. If you watch the LSU game, and if you agree that it wasn't a fluke, then you will see we won that game offensively by running the ball. I don't think anyone would disagree that the LSU defense is one of the best we have or will face this year. If we can run the ball against LSU, then we should be able to run the ball against the rest of our schedule. After this season we lose most of our offense to graduation etc... so we will need the spread next season. This season we have the personnel to line up and smash people with the run game. We should be putting up 300 yards a game on the ground. I think we need to be a run first offense this season. Not ever going to happen the way we currently run it. Silvers can run but we are not utilizing that aspect of the read option. Basically teams do not have an account for him on that play as it is blatantly obvious every time he does pull it for huge gains and then we dont run it again. If you watch UCF this year with their coach running the organ system he ran you have to account for every offensive person on that field especially the quarterback who can run. Just lining up and shot gun then handing the ball off to Chun gets you what we saying against South, eight in the box and tight man coverage. I would love to see a start utilizing our quarterback's mobile ability
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 7:52:45 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 7:52:45 GMT -6
The spread offense is a good offense and I'm not saying we should abandon it... well let's play it differently it for a while. The spread is great until you match it against a defense with speed and the ability to put pressure on the qb. Our OL this year is better at run block than pass protection, hence Silvers gets a lot of pressure. Well ok, we have three world class running backs. If you watch the LSU game, and if you agree that it wasn't a fluke, then you will see we won that game offensively by running the ball. I don't think anyone would disagree that the LSU defense is one of the best we have or will face this year. If we can run the ball against LSU, then we should be able to run the ball against the rest of our schedule. After this season we lose most of our offense to graduation etc... so we will need the spread next season. This season we have the personnel to line up and smash people with the run game. We should be putting up 300 yards a game on the ground. I think we need to be a run first offense this season. Not ever going to happen the way we currently run it. Silvers can run but we are not utilizing that aspect of the read option. Basically teams do not have an account for him on that play as it is blatantly obvious every time he does pull it for huge gains and then we dont run it again. If you watch UCF this year with their coach running the Oregon system he ran you have to account for every offensive person on that field especially the quarterback who can run. Just lining up in shot gun then handing the ball off to Chun gets you what we saying against South, eight in the box and tight man coverage. I would love to see a start utilizing our quarterback's mobile ability
|
|
|
Post by gotroygo on Oct 16, 2017 7:54:44 GMT -6
Just hypothetically , is there any reason Mike Turk isn't discussed if / when Brown does leave? Has he said he wouldn't come back specifically? I just think he'd be a great fit as HC if for some reason Campbell was already hired elsewhere. Campbell could possibly be in the running at Arkansas for all we know. Bielema is toast.
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 9:09:09 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 9:09:09 GMT -6
Just hypothetically , is there any reason Mike Turk isn't discussed if / when Brown does leave? Has he said he wouldn't come back specifically? I just think he'd be a great fit as HC if for some reason Campbell was already hired elsewhere. Campbell could possibly be in the running at Arkansas for all we know. Bielema is toast. The administration burned some bridges with him. They didn't even give him the courtesy of telling him to go fly a kite. Turk is a winner, a leader and was also one of the greatest recruiters Troy ever had. Too many people on this board just looked down on Turk and would never give him a chance. I can tell you one thing having played with him, he is one of the finest men I've ever been around
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 9:32:11 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Hemi Man on Oct 16, 2017 9:32:11 GMT -6
Just hypothetically , is there any reason Mike Turk isn't discussed if / when Brown does leave? Has he said he wouldn't come back specifically? I just think he'd be a great fit as HC if for some reason Campbell was already hired elsewhere. Campbell could possibly be in the running at Arkansas for all we know. Bielema is toast. The administration burned some bridges with him. They didn't even give him the courtesy of telling him to go fly a kite. Turk is a winner, a leader and was also one of the greatest recruiters Troy ever had. Too many people on this board just looked down on Turk and would never give him a chance. I can tell you one thing having played with him, he is one of the finest men I've ever been around I’m all for finding the best man for the job when Neal moves on. If he’s a Troy guy great it not that’s great. Im not concerned with his loyalty to Troy. It’s all about how he produces on the field.
|
|
|
Post by gotroygo on Oct 16, 2017 9:38:48 GMT -6
I’m all for finding the best man for the job when Neal moves on. If he’s a Troy guy great it not that’s great. Im not concerned with his loyalty to Troy. It’s all about how he produces on the field. I'm not a Trojan because of wins and losses.
I want a guy that stays here at least a decade. Brown is a good coach, but be honest, this is a stepping stone job to him
The administration burned some bridges with him. They didn't even give him the courtesy of telling him to go fly a kite. Turk is a winner, a leader and was also one of the greatest recruiters Troy ever had. Too many people on this board just looked down on Turk and would never give him a chance. I can tell you one thing having played with him, he is one of the finest men I've ever been around
To hear that is upsetting. The man is a legend at this institution. He could win a national championship at Huntingdon as well.
|
|
|
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 9:59:33 GMT -6
Next season will also be a huge test of how this staff has recruited. Chun, Silvers, Stadom, Calloway etc were all recruited under the prior staff. Next season will be his players entirely
|
|
|
Post by trojanbrutha on Oct 16, 2017 10:04:38 GMT -6
A decade? In one place? I'm sorry, but they don't do that anymore. Once beamer ball is done, you won't see stints of that kind anymore...not at the FB$ level...
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 10:46:16 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Hemi Man on Oct 16, 2017 10:46:16 GMT -6
I’m all for finding the best man for the job when Neal moves on. If he’s a Troy guy great it not that’s great. Im not concerned with his loyalty to Troy. It’s all about how he produces on the field. I'm not a Trojan because of wins and losses. I want a guy that stays here at least a decade. Brown is a good coach, but be honest, this is a stepping stone job to him The administration burned some bridges with him. They didn't even give him the courtesy of telling him to go fly a kite. Turk is a winner, a leader and was also one of the greatest recruiters Troy ever had. Too many people on this board just looked down on Turk and would never give him a chance. I can tell you one thing having played with him, he is one of the finest men I've ever been around To hear that is upsetting. The man is a legend at this institution. He could win a national championship at Huntingdon as well. If we have a coach for a decade, in football, it’s likely he’s doing just enough to get by and not get fired. There’s nothing wrong with bringing in a guy looking to take the next step. He will put his best foot forward and will take Troy to the next level in hopes of furthering his career. There are no career destination jobs within the Sun Belt.
|
|
|
Post by Bubba the Trojan on Oct 16, 2017 10:58:39 GMT -6
I’m all for finding the best man for the job when Neal moves on. If he’s a Troy guy great it not that’s great. Im not concerned with his loyalty to Troy. It’s all about how he produces on the field. I'm not a Trojan because of wins and losses. I want a guy that stays here at least a decade. Brown is a good coach, but be honest, this is a stepping stone job to him The administration burned some bridges with him. They didn't even give him the courtesy of telling him to go fly a kite. Turk is a winner, a leader and was also one of the greatest recruiters Troy ever had. Too many people on this board just looked down on Turk and would never give him a chance. I can tell you one thing having played with him, he is one of the finest men I've ever been around To hear that is upsetting. The man is a legend at this institution. He could win a national championship at Huntingdon as well. If we have a coach for a decade, in football, it’s likely he’s doing just enough to get by and not get fired. There’s nothing wrong with bringing in a guy looking to take the next step. He will put his best foot forward and will take Troy to the next level in hopes of furthering his career. There are no career destination jobs within the Sun Belt. CLB, and his success, spoiled us and caused us (me included) to have unrealistic expectations for head coaching tenure at TROY. If we are successful, we will be in a constant state of program reconstruction because we will turn over coaching staff every 3-5 year. I don't like that, but it's reality.
|
|
|
Post by gotroygo on Oct 16, 2017 11:41:10 GMT -6
CLB, and his success, spoiled us and caused us (me included) to have unrealistic expectations for head coaching tenure at TROY. If we are successful, we will be in a constant state of program reconstruction because we will turn over coaching staff every 3-5 year. I don't like that, but it's reality.
Disagree. If we hired Campbell I think he would be successful and stay, same with Turk if we could bring him back to Troy. Doesn't have to be an alum, just a guy who wants to build something here long term. We could pay enough and have the right facilities for that scenario. Our expectations here should be to compete for the title and be bowl eligible every year. With our tradition, this is all possible long term.
|
|
|
Post by TheAmericanDream on Oct 16, 2017 11:45:37 GMT -6
No Turk.
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 12:12:31 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Troystet on Oct 16, 2017 12:12:31 GMT -6
You underestimate a winner
|
|
|
Post by Bubba the Trojan on Oct 16, 2017 18:49:24 GMT -6
CLB, and his success, spoiled us and caused us (me included) to have unrealistic expectations for head coaching tenure at TROY. If we are successful, we will be in a constant state of program reconstruction because we will turn over coaching staff every 3-5 year. I don't like that, but it's reality. Disagree. If we hired Campbell I think he would be successful and stay, same with Turk if we could bring him back to Troy. Doesn't have to be an alum, just a guy who wants to build something here long term. We could pay enough and have the right facilities for that scenario. Our expectations here should be to compete for the title and be bowl eligible every year. With our tradition, this is all possible long term.I disagree. Competing for a conference title and bowl appearance should be the MINIMUM expectation every year. Our football personnel - from the AD to the lowest paid football assistant - should be focused not only on those expectations, but on growing the program from a competitive and financial standpoint and increasing student, alumni, and community buy in and involvement. Now the fact that a couple of different names have been mentioned in this thread in no way means these comments are directed to them. I know neither of those men and they both have impressive resumes. If, however, we desire for our program to continue to grow and continue to improve when CNB or JM is gone, we must make sure that the individual hired can accomplish the off field goals as well as the on field ones. It's not as simple as winning the conference and going to a bowl.
|
|
|
UAB / ASU
Oct 16, 2017 18:57:25 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by ksdtrojan on Oct 16, 2017 18:57:25 GMT -6
CLB, and his success, spoiled us and caused us (me included) to have unrealistic expectations for head coaching tenure at TROY. If we are successful, we will be in a constant state of program reconstruction because we will turn over coaching staff every 3-5 year. I don't like that, but it's reality. Disagree. If we hired Campbell I think he would be successful and stay, same with Turk if we could bring him back to Troy. Doesn't have to be an alum, just a guy who wants to build something here long term. We could pay enough and have the right facilities for that scenario. Our expectations here should be to compete for the title and be bowl eligible every year. With our tradition, this is all possible long term.I disagree. Competing for a conference title and bowl appearance should be the MINIMUM expectation every year. Our football personnel - from the AD to the lowest paid football assistant - should be focused not only on those expectations, but on growing the program from a competitive and financial standpoint and increasing student, alumni, and community buy in and involvement. Now the fact that a couple of different names have been mentioned in this thread in no way means these comments are directed to them. I know neither of those men and they both have impressive resumes. If, however, we desire for our program to continue to grow and continue to improve when CNB or JM is gone, we must make sure that the individual hired can accomplish the off field goals as well as the on field ones. It's not as simple as winning the conference and going to a bowl. Well said. 100% agree.
|
|
|
Post by gotroygo on Oct 16, 2017 19:18:14 GMT -6
Going to bowls every year helps the rest happen. Going to fbs has been good for the school as a whole get it I'm sold. That being said what ever level we are on we need 100 support. The revenue and exposure helps the main educational mission.All alums need to support this school otherwise you aren't a real trojan. I'm talking to you wishy washy alabama/ auburn gear wearing troy is not a real program people
|
|
|
Post by startedasredwave on Oct 16, 2017 22:07:31 GMT -6
CLB, and his success, spoiled us and caused us (me included) to have unrealistic expectations for head coaching tenure at TROY. If we are successful, we will be in a constant state of program reconstruction because we will turn over coaching staff every 3-5 year. I don't like that, but it's reality. Disagree. If we hired Campbell I think he would be successful and stay, same with Turk if we could bring him back to Troy. Doesn't have to be an alum, just a guy who wants to build something here long term. We could pay enough and have the right facilities for that scenario. Our expectations here should be to compete for the title and be bowl eligible every year. With our tradition, this is all possible long term.I disagree. Competing for a conference title and bowl appearance should be the MINIMUM expectation every year. Our football personnel - from the AD to the lowest paid football assistant - should be focused not only on those expectations, but on growing the program from a competitive and financial standpoint and increasing student, alumni, and community buy in and involvement. Now the fact that a couple of different names have been mentioned in this thread in no way means these comments are directed to them. I know neither of those men and they both have impressive resumes. If, however, we desire for our program to continue to grow and continue to improve when CNB or JM is gone, we must make sure that the individual hired can accomplish the off field goals as well as the on field ones. It's not as simple as winning the conference and going to a bowl. Agreed. Our goal should be all the involvement mentioned here, domination of the Sun Belt which is the only way we'll ever get out of it and competing at the top of the Group of 5 for that one New Year's Day bowl available. To be known when we travel and have the clout to bring more big games to Troy. We've done the one step forward two steps back dance last year and this. It's time, and we're capable, of taking many more steps forward than back.
|
|